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Grizzly Hughes

What do you want to see happen in medical?

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I am opening this topic to those in medical and that have been around to see what works. I am open to suggestions and many ideas. I would like everyone to agree on the way medical is ran so that everyone is happy and stays to make it an active organization.

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I will put one idea of mine that will be implemented int he next few weeks. I will be hosting weekly or bi weekly reviews. So discussions amongst medical personnel. Once I can get a schedule made it will be posted. Feedback is welcome..

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High regulation, written rules, updated doctrine. We need to know what the Junior Staff is allowed to do, and we need to enforce certifications for certain things like they do in Engineering. I have been leading a lot of CLS training and I think that needs to be the duty of all senior medical staff. I've been taught by Rev on how to install bionics, so I'd like there to be a certification on that and I'd like to be able to train people to be certified in it, though it would be a rather advanced course. I used to give the marines lectures when I lead Fireteam Bravo, and that worked quite well and I believe they are an effective means of education. This being said, we shouldn't pressure the Juniors to learn anything they aren't ready for besides basic GSW and impalement, and if they refuse to correctly learn this they must be removed from Medical. I've got a lot more ideas but I'll write them down later.

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4 minutes ago, Fitz said:

we need to enforce certifications for certain things like they do in Engineering.

This, as I briefly touched on in TS, having proper rank structure like IE Second Specs can help train 3Spcs with small things, Spc. help 2Spc. something so that we don't have 6 3Spcs running around with no one to train them because the Medical Command staff is none existent, something that I think always has a huge influence in the faction dying 

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We need an active TSgt. or MSpc. as soon as possible. Not sure how they'd be picked, but possibly a review.

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One thing that's been bugging me since I've joined is rank bloat. There doesn't seem to be any reason for verticality within the medical detachment as neither none of the higher ranks have been present to adequately integrate and promote new medical staff into full fledged medical staff nor is there really any need for medics to be of higher rank than one another if they are trained to a capable level.

 

I'd like to introduce a cooperation between FFRL and Medical to create new tools, drugs and other horseshit we might wanna fuck around with in the field. I can expand on this later cause I've got a shitload of ideas for it.

 

I'm largely against " High regulation, written rules, updated doctrine. ", mainly because it creates a lot of restriction within the role play that don't necessarily coincide with the population of the medical division or the server. Ideally, we'd have three groups of medics, leadership (Technical Sergeant and Division Lead), Line Medics and Medical Trainees. The leads would be self explanatory, they'd admit, run events for medics, organize competitions, assign tasks, etc. Whenever I've ran a medical division, I've opted to give the line medics who are trained from A-Z free roam to perform surgery, pharmaceutical prescriptions, nurse work, biotech etc. I found that they'd happily work their way into their own niches and agree with each other who'd specialize where and they'd operate together. If any problems arose it'd go up to the T-Sergeant and then the lead. Medical Trainees are just learning the ropes and progressively qualify, effectively attaching to a line medic and operating as their subordinate for a while sorta like shadowing a doctor. Pairing them up creates relationships, roleplay and is a little bit more interesting than being talked at. I can add more, answer any questions later on, this is just a brief post.

 

The chief reason for getting rid of complex rank structure is, it inhibits some medics who know what they're doing from doing their job because they have yet to reach an artificial rung. Once they qualify as a line medic, effectively functioning as a jack of all trades within the division, they can specialize later and can either be given an in-division patch or we can possibly include a Senior Specialist rank. Otherwise you just have a ladder of arbitrary ranks that either inhibit some from contributing or just do not vary enough between ranks to really warrant any seniority over the other.

 

Taking the player base into account we usually only have three medics around at absolute most, often the average is between one or two. So keeping ranks to a minimum makes sense to me. I'm rambling so I'll just wait until someone picks apart my post and I'll clarify then, I think as I type.

 

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11 minutes ago, hewhogrillsbears said:

One thing that's been bugging me since I've joined is rank bloat. There doesn't seem to be any reason for verticality within the medical detachment as neither none of the higher ranks have been present to adequately integrate and promote new medical staff into full fledged medical staff nor is there really any need for medics to be of higher rank than one another if they are trained to a capable level.

 

I'd like to introduce a cooperation between FFRL and Medical to create new tools, drugs and other horseshit we might wanna fuck around with in the field. I can expand on this later cause I've got a shitload of ideas for it.

 

I'm largely against " High regulation, written rules, updated doctrine. ", mainly because it creates a lot of restriction within the role play that don't necessarily coincide with the population of the medical division or the server. Ideally, we'd have three groups of medics, leadership (Technical Sergeant and Division Lead), Line Medics and Medical Trainees. The leads would be self explanatory, they'd admit, run events for medics, organize competitions, assign tasks, etc. Whenever I've ran a medical division, I've opted to give the line medics who are trained from A-Z free roam to perform surgery, pharmaceutical prescriptions, nurse work, biotech etc. I found that they'd happily work their way into their own niches and agree with each other who'd specialize where and they'd operate together. If any problems arose it'd go up to the T-Sergeant and then the lead. Medical Trainees are just learning the ropes and progressively qualify, effectively attaching to a line medic and operating as their subordinate for a while sorta like shadowing a doctor. Pairing them up creates relationships, roleplay and is a little bit more interesting than being talked at. I can add more, answer any questions later on, this is just a brief post.

 

The chief reason for getting rid of complex rank structure is, it inhibits some medics who know what they're doing from doing their job because they have yet to reach an artificial rung. Once they qualify as a line medic, effectively functioning as a jack of all trades within the division, they can specialize later and can either be given an in-division patch or we can possibly include a Senior Specialist rank. Otherwise you just have a ladder of arbitrary ranks that either inhibit some from contributing or just do not vary enough between ranks to really warrant any seniority over the other.

 

Taking the player base into account we usually only have three medics around at absolute most, often the average is between one or two. So keeping ranks to a minimum makes sense to me. I'm rambling so I'll just wait until someone picks apart my post and I'll clarify then, I think as I type.

 

While I disagree with abolishing the rank structure due to the regularity of people needing to feel their progression by means of ranking up, (This is like the Weapon Specializtion ranks, where they made it look like a sense of progression.) 

 

I 100% agree with the stance of less 'regulation', half the reason Medical has a low recruitment/holding rate on players is that the Roleplay standard is too intensive for the type of missions that are run. I'm on the side of simplifiing the Medical Divison to make it more accessable. At current moment, it feels like you have to know the insides and out of treating every minor detail or you risk looking unintelligent. I myself have barely any actual medical experience, nor real keen interest in researching it to a extent. There are those who love it, IE pretty sure Bear knows 10x more then I know, and those who just play it cause its its a change of pace, IE Me.

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1 hour ago, hewhogrillsbears said:

One thing that's been bugging me since I've joined is rank bloat. There doesn't seem to be any reason for verticality within the medical detachment as neither none of the higher ranks have been present to adequately integrate and promote new medical staff into full fledged medical staff nor is there really any need for medics to be of higher rank than one another if they are trained to a capable level.

 

I'd like to introduce a cooperation between FFRL and Medical to create new tools, drugs and other horseshit we might wanna fuck around with in the field. I can expand on this later cause I've got a shitload of ideas for it.

 

I'm largely against " High regulation, written rules, updated doctrine. ", mainly because it creates a lot of restriction within the role play that don't necessarily coincide with the population of the medical division or the server. Ideally, we'd have three groups of medics, leadership (Technical Sergeant and Division Lead), Line Medics and Medical Trainees. The leads would be self explanatory, they'd admit, run events for medics, organize competitions, assign tasks, etc. Whenever I've ran a medical division, I've opted to give the line medics who are trained from A-Z free roam to perform surgery, pharmaceutical prescriptions, nurse work, biotech etc. I found that they'd happily work their way into their own niches and agree with each other who'd specialize where and they'd operate together. If any problems arose it'd go up to the T-Sergeant and then the lead. Medical Trainees are just learning the ropes and progressively qualify, effectively attaching to a line medic and operating as their subordinate for a while sorta like shadowing a doctor. Pairing them up creates relationships, roleplay and is a little bit more interesting than being talked at. I can add more, answer any questions later on, this is just a brief post.

 

The chief reason for getting rid of complex rank structure is, it inhibits some medics who know what they're doing from doing their job because they have yet to reach an artificial rung. Once they qualify as a line medic, effectively functioning as a jack of all trades within the division, they can specialize later and can either be given an in-division patch or we can possibly include a Senior Specialist rank. Otherwise you just have a ladder of arbitrary ranks that either inhibit some from contributing or just do not vary enough between ranks to really warrant any seniority over the other.

 

Taking the player base into account we usually only have three medics around at absolute most, often the average is between one or two. So keeping ranks to a minimum makes sense to me. I'm rambling so I'll just wait until someone picks apart my post and I'll clarify then, I think as I type.

  

 

47 minutes ago, CamGrrr said:

While I disagree with abolishing the rank structure due to the regularity of people needing to feel their progression by means of ranking up, (This is like the Weapon Specializtion ranks, where they made it look like a sense of progression.) 

  

I 100% agree with the stance of less 'regulation', half the reason Medical has a low recruitment/holding rate on players is that the Roleplay standard is too intensive for the type of missions that are run. I'm on the side of simplifiing the Medical Divison to make it more accessable. At current moment, it feels like you have to know the insides and out of treating every minor detail or you risk looking unintelligent. I myself have barely any actual medical experience, nor real keen interest in researching it to a extent. There are those who love it, IE pretty sure Bear knows 10x more then I know, and those who just play it cause its its a change of pace, IE Me.

If you know what's required to be promoted, you will be promoted. Bears, the only reason you've not been promoted is because we had no staff, but now we do. The ranks don't need to be abolished, you will just be promoted like how it works with certification with engineers as I said.

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Make it approachable. 

 

Guides are handy. The one Dex created, I use it quite frequently. It makes the roleplay easier for those with no medical background and it makes things fun. 

 

Medical is a hard faction because it is roleplay intensive sometimes, however you have to be present and show that it doesn't take a six paragraph /me to stitch a fleshwound. 

 

Not all that join medical will have any medical knowledge. Most still have their parents put Band-Aids on and won't be able to tell the difference between a steri strip and a bandaid. 

 

Training is good, but make sure it's not dry. If it is kinda dry, keep them short. One thing at a time. This is how we do stitches. End training. People won't want to sit for hours in an uninteresting situation. 

 

Also, another thing that is turning people off from medical is certain people within medical telling them "you can't do this, you're a 3Spc, you can't put stitches in. Uhhh... Wot? Unpon entering medical, everyone should be able to do basic medical things. The medics ICly go through a basic medical training, even if it doesn't happen on server. Who wants to be a medic if they can't do anything or are constantly being told they can't by someone that is not in charge but on a power trip? 

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On 7/6/2018 at 9:24 AM, HazyDay said:

Also, another thing that is turning people off from medical is certain people within medical telling them "you can't do this, you're a 3Spc, you can't put stitches in. Uhhh... Wot? Unpon entering medical, everyone should be able to do basic medical things. The medics ICly go through a basic medical training, even if it doesn't happen on server. Who wants to be a medic if they can't do anything or are constantly being told they can't by someone that is not in charge but on a power trip? 

This could change to be less broad a definition, but at the moment Third Specialists can't perform surgeries. I personally would prefer to keep it that way, and just promote people to Second Specialist who know what they're doing so they can start out with some basic to intermediate surgeries, but people forget how temporary Third Specialist is supposed to be a rank. It's the rookie rank; we shouldn't have vets as a rookie rank.

 

I think it's valuable to promote an easier time for Third Specialist, and most of the is just **reading the damn guides**, I would say, but to be honest, we don't want quantity to completely overrule quality. There are certain people who we have seen are not fit for medical, and I'm talking about multiple people here so please do not draw assumptions here, yet they would really like to be a medic. If you can't have the patience to not wait for the first basic promotion before you perform a surgery, you're not fit to be a medic in my opinion. 

 

I have to stress this: the Third Specialist rank is supposed to be temporary, and we'd only these problems because we'd no staff to promote them

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To be quite honest, Medical is fine the way it is (or was?). The issue with the faction is that it is a 'High-Population' faction, meaning it only truly thrives when the server has a large population.

 

I will also agree to earlier claims that the RP is too intensive. As both Medics and Players can attest to, awaiting for the /me to save your life is painstakingly long and often overly detailed.

 

Because I can't be bothered to type this out on my phone, my summary is simple: Leave it how it was, and simplify. The MI and Engineers are typically thriving factions because they're simple.

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5 hours ago, Maple Leaf Moosefucker said:

To be quite honest, Medical is fine the way it is (or was?). The issue with the faction is that it is a 'High-Population' faction, meaning it only truly thrives when the server has a large population.

 

I will also agree to earlier claims that the RP is too intensive. As both Medics and Players can attest to, awaiting for the /me to save your life is painstakingly long and often overly detailed.

 

Because I can't be bothered to type this out on my phone, my summary is simple: Leave it how it was, and simplify. The MI and Engineers are typically thriving factions because they're simple.

I personally don't find the RP too intensive, though, there is an issue with the whole high-population cap ordeal, some kind of changes need to be made for more incentives to players wanting to join, and even continue to exist within medicals. How, I sure as hell don't know. 

 

And, some might find it too intensive when they first start out, but with the right leadership, and right trainers, they can find themselves rather knowledgeable within a weeks time of how to treat day-to-day combat wounds, and surgical procedures required later on. I don't know about today's leadership and staff, since I haven't been on for awhile for reasons of LOA, but I'm sure they're following up things right that were leftover from previous predecessors.

 

Maybe I'm just being too naive, I don't know.

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1 hour ago, LoadedGun said:

I don't know about today's leadership and staff

There is really no leadership or staff at all at the moment besides Specialists and the lead.

 

I think what I would like to do is more OOC medical training so people understand it better n' stuff, because doing it IC has complications, and isn't sufficient on its own.

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On 7/6/2018 at 6:49 PM, Fitz said:

This could change to be less broad a definition, but at the moment Third Specialists can't perform surgeries. I personally would prefer to keep it that way, and just promote people to Second Specialist who know what they're doing so they can start out with some basic to intermediate surgeries, but people forget how temporary Third Specialist is supposed to be a rank. It's the rookie rank; we shouldn't have vets as a rookie rank.

 

I think it's valuable to promote an easier time for Third Specialist, and most of the is just **reading the damn guides**, I would say, but to be honest, we don't want quantity to completely overrule quality. There are certain people who we have seen are not fit for medical, and I'm talking about multiple people here so please do not draw assumptions here, yet they would really like to be a medic. If you can't have the patience to not wait for the first basic promotion before you perform a surgery, you're not fit to be a medic in my opinion. 

 

I have to stress this: the Third Specialist rank is supposed to be temporary, and we'd only these problems because we'd no staff to promote them

 

In the two years I have been on the server, 3Spc has never been a "temporary" rank for medical. It is an actual rank. People sit at it because they don't do what is required to move up. I'm not saying let 3Spcs do surgery, but basic stitches are not surgery and having a single Spc, or SSpc telling them they can't because it is, is turning people away from the faction. Literally any medic can do stitches. 

 

In my experience, most of the time it's because they think "Oh, Medical is going to be fun." Then they end up feeling like the RP is too intense and too much is required. 

 

The only reason I ended up joining medical is because my best friend IRL was running the faction and she made it easy enough to play a medic without having to do jargon intense /me's. 

 

What you fail to realize is a lot of our playerbase is 13-17 year old kids, most of them don't have the attention span to sit through hours of training OOCly or ICly. Unfortunately, sometimes you have to sacrifice a bit of quality in order to have people play in your faction. Otherwise, it'll go the way the marines went. 

 

 

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3 hours ago, HazyDay said:

In the two years I have been on the server, 3Spc has never been a "temporary" rank for medical. It is an actual rank. People sit at it because they don't do what is required to move up.

It is my opinion that it should be, and that's why I'm putting it in this thread.

3 hours ago, HazyDay said:

People sit at it because they don't do what is required to move up. I'm not saying let 3Spcs do surgery, but basic stitches are not surgery and having a single Spc, or SSpc telling them they can't because it is, is turning people away from the faction. Literally any medic can do stitches. 

If they aren't willing to do what it takes, they won't be promoted and that's fine. Stitching is surgery, and I'm not saying ban Third Spec's from doing this, but first they must be certified on the basics which is something I'm going to work on getting set up. I've seen a lot of 3Spc.'s mess this up, and they need to be taught. As I said, "This could change to be less broad a definition". Not literally any medic can do stitches because I've seen them fail. It would be a short certification, and you take it one step at a time, but nonetheless required.  

3 hours ago, HazyDay said:

In my experience, most of the time it's because they think "Oh, Medical is going to be fun." Then they end up feeling like the RP is too intense and too much is required. 

I believe most of the time people are able to extrapolate the experiences they have on the server with medRP and are able to relate it to themselves in order to make an accurate prediction of what it'll be like. There's no way to prove it either way though, and I agree we need to make the landing a softer one. A good thing to do is to set up an actual schedule with the person as far as training to space everything out to not overwhelm them yet still give them an adequate amount of it.

3 hours ago, HazyDay said:

The only reason I ended up joining medical is because my best friend IRL was running the faction and she made it easy enough to play a medic without having to do jargon intense /me's. 

I wouldn't know anything about this as this is before my time on the server, but if you have any specific tips from that period it would be appreciated.

3 hours ago, HazyDay said:

What you fail to realize is a lot of our playerbase is 13-17 year old kids, most of them don't have the attention span to sit through hours of training OOCly or ICly. Unfortunately, sometimes you have to sacrifice a bit of quality in order to have people play in your faction. 

That's why you space it out and make it digestible, which I'll admit is difficult to organize but I believe it's the most beneficial solution from my own and others' experiences. 

3 hours ago, HazyDay said:

Otherwise, it'll go the way the marines went. 

The marines were banned for the polar opposite reason, that I'm certain of. I believe using the marines as an example is completely irrelevant to this conversation as one who really saw what happened in that situation from the inside. I won't get into the details to try to keep this on track. 

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medical needs to either go full on realism, or just enough to pass as "acceptable"

 

dex & i pushed for full realism; the faction died, but we were reliant enough to keep it running - saying this externally, a lot of the more promising candidates left because of how SSTRP was as a whole, instead of medical

 

i dont see a way for medical to fix that. it's just not possible. the RP as a whole cant be changed for one group's ideas, so leave realism behind

 

dumb everything down a ton. rev did well enough to supply the most basic forms of treatment known to mankind - that could still be viewed as 'realistic' treatments. make the idea of being a medic more approachable. easy treatments, void surgeries as a whole unless the person REALLY wants to do them, and make some events for medical to spice it up. make it fun.

 

the current problem is, you're working off an old system - more specifically, one Dex and I put into place. it requires someone who is fluent in those ideas to teach the same ideas; i did my best to dumb everything down, but Dex has a hard-on for realism.

 

the system people turn to currently is outdated. that same system is working the ground out from underneath you, as it did the previous medleads. take what you, as the lead, can understand from dex's outline; and rework it to something you're passionate about. this'll push some players away, but the passion you bring will draw in more. you'll find it easier to pull players. find it easier to teach certain things - to answer advanced questions on it.

 

tl;dr dex and i created a system that is ruining your foundation, take what you can from it and recreate it to better suit you. don't sweat the house until it's got something stable to build on top of

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@Grizzly Hughes

 

I'm a bit late to post here, but I figure it might be helpful anyways. If you don't want to go for a full-on realism deal like what Falco & Dex did, your best alternative is to teach people the fundamentals and just sort of 'wing it' from there.

 

Teach people how to dress a wound. Neither they nor your patient are going to care what kind of gauze / bandage you're using, nor the materials it's made from, nor the brand name. Nobody gives a shit about that. I guarantee the majority of people you med RP point out their injury and tab out while your medic gives their paragraph of jargon. Make a list of simple terminology, stick to it, teach it until everyone knows it inside and out.

 

Teach them what an analgesic is.

Teach them what packing a wound means.

Teach them when to / not to remove shrapnel / bullets / talons.

Teach them the difference between a local anesthetic and a general.

 

You can do a lot of things with fundamental terminology. The guy you're treating isn't going to care if you describe cleaning his injury out with 'a disinfecting agent' or if you go into detail about how you hit him up with X CCs of betadine-saline solution and then fush with more saline. Again, it rounds back to the 'who cares this is a video game' factor.

 

Surgery is a little more tricky. I never actually RPd doing it as medlead. I never RPd doing it before I was med lead. You can usually chalk that kind of thing up to IC doctors if you cba to learn how to plate ribs. Alternatively, I'm certain that if you wanted to pull some medical equipment from other lores and then tweak it in order to make sense in SST, @Xalphox wouldn't mind so long as you speak with him about it. I was encouraged to do so, and would go so far as to say I'm willing to give you the suggestions that I drew up but never quite finished. Medical hasn't actually 'gotten' anything new in roughly an OOC year, while every other faction has. I think that the notion of making medics more versatile would spark more interest in people wanting to be one, as they would at that point be doing more intricate things than just patching up bullet / talon holes and putting tourniquets on missing limbs.

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