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Gromborg

Medical Rolls

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Hi, I've been talking about this in the other thread, but I want a discussion based solely on MEDICS being forced to roll. My proposal is that medics should roll under high stress, duress under fire, or grievous situations. This comes from the fact that, as my character was shot 4 times point blank and tumbled three stories down, while I didn't necessarily roll PK rolls, I was -very- inclined to self-pk out of principle unless the trooper providing CLS didn't do the exact proper techniques. However, as I realized the person that was treating me knew his medrp, I instantly knew felt conflicted. I didn't want to self-pk at that point because it drew me out of the moment, as the trooper was performing these actions -perfectly-. This simply couldn't be the case 100% of the time. 

 

No matter how skilled you are, you will fuck up. We see this in the case of psychics, engineers, and MI, but why not medics? Medics have the great ability to just churn out paragraphs of correct procedure and be done with it, but how can you reasonably say that without a doubt, you will succeed in every high stress situation? An admin can easily say, yes, your wounds were too grievous and PK regardless of the medrp, but I rarely see this happen (especially when I treat people lololol). I don't know if I'm not around enough, granted I did just return, but the capability for any medic to simply /me a wound to stability is immersion breaking.

 

People will say, "But how is it fair to leave my character's life in the hands of someone else's roll, even if I already rolled?" Well, the wound may not have out right killed you, but a medic can certainly fuck up while trying to treat that wound. Take for example, attempting to insert an IV after packing a wound, there's blood on your hands, literally. You can't say without a doubt, that on your first attempt of trying to insert an IV while under duress, that you will hit that MCV. Once you're injured, your life is in the hands of the medic treating you. While they may know the procedure by heart, that doesn't mean they won't clot that bleeding 100% of the time, or insert that IV 100% of the time, or stop that arterial bleeding 100% of the time. 

 

I suppose the biggest issue would be leaving your character in the hands of another, but it's worth some discussion I think. I just feel like medics are overpowered please nerf.

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10 minutes ago, Gromborg said:

My proposal is that medics should roll under high stress, duress under fire, or grievous situations.

I can see the points raised here, Medics never really fail. However, I would have to say a big part of that is due to how much training and such Medics go through. The extensive amounts of knowledge they have to learn and such. 

The only time I've ever encouraged/had a Medic roll for something is simply working against the clock. If someone is bleeding out from several gunshot wounds, yes you will see the Medic patch each wound up, but I'd say having them roll to see if they do it fast enough can be applied. Since, if we're being honest, they likelihood of someone plugging up 6-7 gunshot wounds perfectly before someone bleeds to death from each of those shots is such a difficult thing to do. 

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Just now, OpTiCFaZeSoCkzZz said:

I can see the points raised here, Medics never really fail. However, I would have to say a big part of that is due to how much training and such Medics go through. The extensive amounts of knowledge they have to learn and such. 

The only time I've ever encouraged/had a Medic roll for something is simply working against the clock. If someone is bleeding out from several gunshot wounds, yes you will see the Medic patch each wound up, but I'd say having them roll to see if they do it fast enough can be applied. Since, if we're being honest, they likelihood of someone plugging up 6-7 gunshot wounds perfectly before someone bleeds to death from each of those shots is such a difficult thing to do. 

One of the biggest issues in medical for any server at any time has been the knowledge and effort that goes into learning it -- But, literally just watch any experienced medrper, read their paragraphs, you can pick up a thing or two. I like that idea, especially since Celox takes time and pressure to work, it just hits me in a way that I don't like. I would never want to impose these rules on a newer medrper, but I also believe newer medrpers would leave these wounds to the more seasoned players. Again, I'm only suggesting this for EXTRANEOUS circumstances.

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like i said to you; i can't agree with this idea in the slightest.

 

perhaps if the injured rolled a 5 or below, the medic could roll (with bonuses based on their rank) about saving the person, admins running missions could choose to 'run a clock' against them, etcetera etcetera

 

but - what you used as an example to me in looc; someone having bloodied gloves rolls for inserting an I.V; it's stupid. i mean that in the nicest way possible: it's stupid. nobody plays a roleplay about fighting massive bugs and glowing aliens in space so that they can stress about every tiny detail in their roleplay -- and when i said nobody, i mean nobody. no admin is going to sit and drag their event out for 10 extra minutes so 3Spc. Dick Van Dyke can structure his roleplay out so that he's not missing any tiny detail.

 

if i wanted that realism, i'd go join a PJ brigade or something. i'm here to shoot space aliens, patch up space wounds, and fuck space bitches

 

it's redundant to put that much realism into medrpers, when our realism is already the highest point the server has. because of this, we have the lowest active player count - to enforce this rule, would just push more people out. we'd cut off our only remaining limb by doing this. it'd be, quite genuinely, unfair to play a medic: we'd be cycling through people like no other, because people would play - kill four injured on accident - or make their wounds worse - and then proceed to hate the job more. alternatively, the rest of the server would have to do the same!

 

you don't see engineers rolling to see if they put their nuke in the m55 properly; fuck that.

 

tl;dr roll 5 or under, medic rolls with rank boost, see if it works out. otherwise this is a terrible idea for the longevity of medical

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I mean the main reason people blast correct paragraphs every time is because they have access to a thread with a ton of possible injuries and just keep it open for when they need it. I have my own notes that I use so I don't use it as often but I know it is used by a lot of other people religiously. That thread is a blessing on its own for a lot of people because before that thread every medic had to learn how to do it from someone else.

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Medics rolling for anything to do with treating someone is dumb, even if its for serious injuries only. Makes the learning they went through pointless, you could have someone who is a really fucking good medic, knows everything, do a perfect /me to help someone with an injury, only for a roll to fuck it all up. 

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3 hours ago, LoFiSuicide said:

no admin is going to sit and drag their event out for 10 extra minutes so 3Spc. Dick Van Dyke can structure his roleplay out so that he's not missing any tiny detail.

This is probably touching on it. 

 

Speaking as an Admin. I can say that it's very rare for Admin to know the Fact sheets of every faction, as well as the training for each faction. This is of course compounded if the Admin is also doing things such as College, University or Work. While this can be ignored to a Degree with factions such as Marauders "Oh. The Marauder suddenly has more Y-Racks because [Insert Plot reason here]" or Engineers "The Bottomless pack of Engineering M55 Warheads continues to produce a 50th Explosion. Even though there's 1 Engineer and the Combined weight of those Warheads would've crushed his spine."  - With what was suggested, of keeping an Active check to ensure Medical have done the right training, it would be near impossible without a dedicated admin who knows Medical RP to a T.  And yes, as Centrix noted there is a thread, many people will deviate from that to add their own flare of writing, so a direct copy and paste wouldn't be the same. 

 

If you know your Medical knowledge, are being treated and see that it is being done wrong. Feel free to look at the thread - http://sstrp.net/index.php?/topic/2565-permakills-pks-temporary-kills-tks-injuries/&tab=comments#comment-25840 - On Kills. It would then be on the onus of evidence that it be truly considered a Mistreatment, and would have a subsequent Court Martial over those Findings even if they're clearly shown as innocent. 

 

Sorry if it's long-windy or tangenty, stealthy posting from Work PC xD 

 

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4 minutes ago, Admyral Joe said:

 

Sorry if it's long-windy or tangenty, stealthy posting from Work PC xD

 

As if we all aren't :P 

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7 minutes ago, Admyral Joe said:

This is probably touching on it. 

 

Speaking as an Admin. I can say that it's very rare for Admin to know the Fact sheets of every faction, as well as the training for each faction.

 

we have factions?

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tbf it depends on the admin that oversees the injury

If someone gave improper or insufficient treatment while I was handling the injury I'd penalize them for it so, if they hadn't paid attention to their medrp101 lesson it's gama ovar

But like I said, depends on the admin that oversees it. It does require some knowledge of medical which not all admins have so, it can't be expected of everyone.

 

As for medics simply keeping threads and sites open to check what procedure to apply, I personally don't do that unless it's something on ship or otherwise a non-combat scenario. I've learned most of the things we face by heart

But not everyone does that, and it's not like we can really police it so /shrug. I'd love if people would learn how to treat injuries by heart before moving up in specialist rank, with no need to open sstrp.net/medrp

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Oh also, perhaps an assistant admin that specifically deals with the small details while the main adminges work the overall event. It definitely heightens the experience when you get to do proper medrp or engirp with an admin actively watching and responding.

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You're lucky to get 2 medics on a drop, much less 3 or more. This would only further discourage activity in a faction of people you always need more of.

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as a medic myself, i'd no longer be inclined to play on drops if something like this were put in to place. 

 

if i do everything medrp wise that i was supposed to do, and every /me was on point, but i rolled poorly and killed the person, what's the point? why continue being a medic if the training i go through doesn't matter anymore and it's all left down to a roll? 

 

medrp during drops can be difficult as is with nco's shouting at you to get the person mobile whilst you're in the middle of a /me, adding more stress to the situation will suck all of the fun out of the rp itself. i joined medics because it is a high-rp faction, i enjoy the rp that comes from it on drops. 

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This is literally what the original PK roll is for. A good admin can just write the PK in, taking into account the medical RP. Yes, you did everything right, but the guy was too far gone to help. You win some you lose some. 

Enforcing failures on medical doesn’t just penalise the medic, it penalises the person they’re treating as well, which is hugely unfair. 

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On 3/1/2019 at 11:39 AM, Jun Nagase said:

Oh also, perhaps an assistant admin that specifically deals with the small details while the main adminges work the overall event. It definitely heightens the experience when you get to do proper medrp or engirp with an admin actively watching and responding.

This right here is something I can come to terms to agree with as I feel it'd relieve some stress on the admins for having to pause the whole RP just to perform a medical. Now with that being said (I don't know if the rule is in place) I could agree with the thought of a Medic doing a life saving roll for a severe wound on the ship. With other Medics around to either assist or use the infamous 'Orderlies' to opt for a re-roll dependent on how many Medics are present is something I think that could be a bit more of a balance between the schools of thought. All of the later part is entirely speculative as I like finding a middle ground simple enough for everybody to agree upon.

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