Issue with the new Marauder script

[Guest]

Admins have raised issue with the new script. 

 

I have been given two options. 

 

Go back to the previous script or allow the admins to limit the number of Marauders allowed on the drop. 

 

I'd like to know what you would like to happen.  

[Guest]

Admins have raised issue with the new script. 

 

I have been given two options. 

 

Go back to the previous script or allow the admins to limit the number of Marauders allowed on the drop. 

 

I'd like to know what you would like to happen.  

[TheLynch]

Limit, Honestly there are only roughly 1-3 marauders max on at anytime anyway.

 

I dont see much wrong with the script other than then they dont take damage from bug's. Anyway, Marauders are where they are i feel and the admins that are complaining just want to jam the suits with pieces of random debris whenever we died before most of the time having to be respawned easily 3-6 times throughout a drop spamming /report for it too every time. this new script allows us to literally do what its kinda meant for, I mean just because they get rekt and can't go on a massive killing spree with op weapons that two or three shot you isn't really a reason to go back to the old script, It was terrible and ever since the new script people want to play as them, So yea.

[Dan]

Admins limiting the amount of marauders on a drop is a wrong move. We barely have enough active members as it is. Besides, it VERY easily just makes the faction completely inactive if only one or two are allowed to drop. No one will be interested in the faction as it dies and ruins chances for character development on drops. 

 

What this sounds like is the rest of the admin team is pissy they can’t gook marauders and are forced to take into account the armor they have. While NOT impenetrable, is very durable. Besides, like you said, be prepared for target PKs with the admins and marauders

 

if admin events are so fragile and hastily put together that one or two marauders ruins it and run the MI trough without issue, they need to learn to make better events and not just half ass an event together for the sake of “Just get a mission going”

[Xalphox]

If we continue to use the power armour in this way, the suit will be nerfed in terms of how much damage it can take from small arms fire - at the moment it takes 1/84th damage for small arms fire. Marauders will continue to be vulnerable to RPGs and explosives. Even this may not be enough: the Mobile Infantry are and always will be the core faction of the server and if the admin team feels that marauders are making the MI redundant then we will protect the MI over the marauders.

 

The marauders have two options in front of them:

 

1. Continue as Heavy Weapon guys with armour equivalent to 7x as much armour as a regular infantryman (as was the case)

 

2. Move to a Marauder = Elite Trooper model of faction where you act as walking talking tanks. I see several potential problems with this:

 

If the marauders are capable of absorbing an absurd amount of damage, it can easily unbalance missions so that they are no longer challenging for the rest of the playerbase - breaking immersion and subtracting from the enjoyment of the majority in favour of pandering to a minority. Meaning we would need to restrict how many marauders can drop - a power that would fall to the individual admins running the events.

I concerned by the Marauder's apparent blase attitude to this, so let me make this clear: this restriction doesn't mean "just 3" (FTR: I can't see any occasion where we'd have 3 marauders short of a Marauder-centric mission or 35+ players), "just 2" or even "just 1": I can easily see half of missions FLAT OUT excluding marauders, because frankly as a seasoned mission maker the hassle that goes into accommodating a small faction whilst still managing the mission as a whole is rarely worth the effort. Think of how many admins are willing to accommodate your Y-racks, jump jets or other marauder features. This is why the original implementation of scouts/Pathfinders are shut down last year, and also in part why Psychics were shut down.

Secondly - how do you pick which of your marauders gets to don the suit reliably? I will not put the burden on the admin team to sequentialise this and you guys are going to have to come up with a fair system that accommodates for the fact that marauders can join mid-mission, that multiple marauders can be ingame for a briefing, or that if you simply have a sequential list that the next option on the list might not be in-game.

 

Thirdly if you are to become an elite unit then I would expect a more rigorous recruitment process (possibly based on nomination by the MI leader?) and frankly I would expect the Marauders as a division to smarten up and to find a way to shun its reputation and perception as a memey ERP-ridden cyberfest. If you become an elite force, then you represent the server above all other characters and I would expect the calibre of the division to represent that. I would expect the roster count to half to 4 or 5 members max.

 

If this is the route you want to take, I will not stand in your way. But I will say that you may be turkeys voting for Christmas. The Mobile Infantry will always come above all other divisions and if any division detracts from the Mobile Infantry then they will be changed or shut down.

[Valkrae]

Limiting the amount of Marauders is what I'd go for.

With the lower playercounts we have, We end up having a 4:1 Marauder-to-MI ratio. Sometimes, we end up with three marauders on a drop of only 12 people.

 

Also, I like the new script.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, Valkrae said:

Limiting the amount of Marauders is what I'd go for.

With the lower playercounts we have, We end up having a 4:1 Marauder-to-MI ratio. Sometimes, we end up with three marauders on a drop of only 12 people.

 

Also, I like the new script.

Can you look at the admin forums. 

[Valkrae]

Already writing a post.

[Dan]

2 hours ago, Xalphox said:

If we continue to use the power armour in this way, the suit will be nerfed in terms of how much damage it can take from small arms fire - at the moment it takes 1/84th damage for small arms fire. Marauders will continue to be vulnerable to RPGs and explosives. Even this may not be enough: the Mobile Infantry are and always will be the core faction of the server and if the admin team feels that marauders are making the MI redundant then we will protect the MI over the marauders.

 

The marauders have two options in front of them:

 

1. Continue as Heavy Weapon guys with armour equivalent to 7x as much armour as a regular infantryman (as was the case)

 

2. Move to a Marauder = Elite Trooper model of faction where you act as walking talking tanks. I see several potential problems with this:

 

If the marauders are capable of absorbing an absurd amount of damage, it can easily unbalance missions so that they are no longer challenging for the rest of the playerbase - breaking immersion and subtracting from the enjoyment of the majority in favour of pandering to a minority. Meaning we would need to restrict how many marauders can drop - a power that would fall to the individual admins running the events.

I concerned by the Marauder's apparent blase attitude to this, so let me make this clear: this restriction doesn't mean "just 3" (FTR: I can't see any occasion where we'd have 3 marauders short of a Marauder-centric mission or 35+ players), "just 2" or even "just 1": I can easily see half of missions FLAT OUT excluding marauders, because frankly as a seasoned mission maker the hassle that goes into accommodating a small faction whilst still managing the mission as a whole is rarely worth the effort. Think of how many admins are willing to accommodate your Y-racks, jump jets or other marauder features. This is why the original implementation of scouts/Pathfinders are shut down last year, and also in part why Psychics were shut down.

Secondly - how do you pick which of your marauders gets to don the suit reliably? I will not put the burden on the admin team to sequentialise this and you guys are going to have to come up with a fair system that accommodates for the fact that marauders can join mid-mission, that multiple marauders can be ingame for a briefing, or that if you simply have a sequential list that the next option on the list might not be in-game.

 

Thirdly if you are to become an elite unit then I would expect a more rigorous recruitment process (possibly based on nomination by the MI leader?) and frankly I would expect the Marauders as a division to smarten up and to find a way to shun its reputation and perception as a memey ERP-ridden cyberfest. If you become an elite force, then you represent the server above all other characters and I would expect the calibre of the division to represent that. I would expect the roster count to half to 4 or 5 members max.

 

If this is the route you want to take, I will not stand in your way. But I will say that you may be turkeys voting for Christmas. The Mobile Infantry will always come above all other divisions and if any division detracts from the Mobile Infantry then they will be changed or shut down.

Xalphox brings up some good points which I appreciate. Overall, If it means implementing a Marauder cap to keep their current armor, then I can accept that. The issue being how do we fairly do it.

 

its nothing personal towards @HazyDay but I’ve always felt that the faction app should be more In depth to prevent some of the characters that have been apart of it. But I’ve talked with her before about it and understand why the app is the way it is. And it’s her faction, she’ll run it how she wants to run, just as I’ll run Engineering how I see fit.

 

As far as I’m aware, marauders aren’t ERP central anymore. But then again it seems like my Marauder is the only one who hasn’t fucked anyone at any point.

 

my main gripe from what this all stems from is that WHENEVER marauders get anything, it’s IMMEDIATELY, complained again how Marauders are TOO OP, OR THIS FACTION IS ERP CENTRAL, THEIR JUST BIG METAL CUNTS WHO RUIN EVERYTHINNG, ETC, ETC, ETC.

[Guest]

The Marauder application process will be changing. 

 

I kept it the same as Gazza and Alice had it, but it admittedly needs work. 

[Centrix]

Honestly I see marauders on  bug only events since bugs would ideally cause the most hassle for MI to do without the support. I think that even if the server has a high pop 2 marauders per event should be the max, (first come first serve). I just don't see marauders on sep events because the high chance of them just walking ahead of the MI and killing every single sep within seconds like three of them did yesterday forcing us to just rocket them and blow a limb off to slow them down. The only trouble I see with seps would be an enemy marauder that could be solved with two ways, blow the fucker up OR call for a marauder but only if the need arises, even then three marauders isn't needed at all.

 

Bug events work a lot differently given the high chance of swarms and royal/tanker classes that can just fuck the MI up without blinking this is really the only spot I see marauders being effective and giving the MI a chance to be in the lead. Marauders can take the main force and the MI handle what they miss, and everybody still gets a fair share of shooting. Unlike sep missions though, the marauders could easily storm ahead and murder everybody while the MI kill two people making it just boring for the MI. 

 

Another thing I see that is common is shitty attitudes towards anybody and everybody from a few marauders. Sure people have free will, but this is an elite faction of the best of the best and most if not all have been an "NCO" in their characters past. This means they had to work with people, they have the experience and probably wouldn't of had that attitude during any of their marauder training or even BCT. So the shitty attitude doesn't help the marauders look like the elitists they should be but just another shit division that people laugh at. If you want to be a respected and needed faction ic and ooc marauders need to be respectable characters in the first place. Limiting the marauders or even changing scripts wont change shit other than the fact they are just not respected by anybody because of how they act. If they gain the respect, are trained properly to work WITH the MI and not on their own as I know they shouldn't then circumstances would be different.

[W0rthy]

23 minutes ago, Centrix said:

The only trouble I see with seps would be an enemy marauder that could be solved with two ways, blow the fucker up OR call for a marauder but only if the need arises, even then three marauders isn't needed at all.

No. Please no.

 

See, this right here is a big concern. A huge concern. Separatists are not going to get weapons or funding very easily at all. If we keep the current canon of Marauder suits being 'elite' technology, then they wouldn't have the ability to even think about building them. The few that could be captured by separatists forces would be so few and so far between that the 112th should only see maybe one or two in their service. If event admins are forced to resort to things like enemy marauders to deal with our own? That's a problem from a lore perspective. The mere fact that it was suggested kind of highlights how far it has gone.

 

I do have to agree with Centrix. If we keep them as literal tanks, limit them to bug drops might be an idea to consider.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, W0rthy said:

No. Please no.

 

See, this right here is a big issue. A huge issue. Separatists are not going to get weapons or funding very easily at all. If we keep the current canon of Marauder suits being 'elite' technology, then they wouldn't have the ability to even think about building them. The few that could be captured by separatists forces would be so few and so far between that the 112th should only see maybe one or two in their service. If event admins are forced to resort to things like enemy marauders to deal with our own? That's a problem from a lore perspective. The mere fact that it was suggested kind of highlights how far it has gone.

 

Exactly this. This has already been discussed in multiple admin meetings and all have agreed that it will not happen.

 

The APE suit exists for a reason, it's the precursor to the AEGIS suit, and old, patched up models are available for admins to use during Sep Events.

[Admyral Joe]

14 hours ago, Dan said:

But then again it seems like my Marauder is the only one who hasn’t fucked anyone at any point.

Making a lot of assumptions there.

Aoife has yet to spread her legs for people.

 

The pokemon dolls however.

 

Most of my comments have already been raised in the admin areas, but for clarity. I am of the belief of nerfs to the Marauders to make them less powerful, and to solve some of the issues with individuals being Erp bait / Constantly Erping.  I'm opposed however to the stance that marauders are transformed into some edge snowflake division. 

[Archer]

8 hours ago, W0rthy said:

No. Please no.

 

See, this right here is a big concern. A huge concern. Separatists are not going to get weapons or funding very easily at all. If we keep the current canon of Marauder suits being 'elite' technology, then they wouldn't have the ability to even think about building them. The few that could be captured by separatists forces would be so few and so far between that the 112th should only see maybe one or two in their service. If event admins are forced to resort to things like enemy marauders to deal with our own? That's a problem from a lore perspective. The mere fact that it was suggested kind of highlights how far it has gone.

 

I do have to agree with Centrix. If we keep them as literal tanks, limit them to bug drops might be an idea to consider.

me and hazyday have actually discussed the lore aspects of having the separatists use marauders, and it's been agreed they can use ape suits if the admin really wants enemy marauders to happen

[El Excellente]

4 hours ago, Admyral Joe said:

Aoife has yet to spread her legs for people.

i'd like to emphasize the yet

[Admyral Joe]

She's asexual. Because the only person I'm going to Erp with is myself ty

[Tonic]

For documentation purposes...

 

The XA's have reached an agreement regarding a plan on how to address the issues mentioned above and in private conversations.

 

The guidelines/points of the agreement will remain private and only shared amongst the administrative team unless Xalphox gives his explicit approval for its dissemination.

[TheLynch]

18 hours ago, Centrix said:

Honestly I see marauders on  bug only events since bugs would ideally cause the most hassle for MI to do without the support. I think that even if the server has a high pop 2 marauders per event should be the max, (first come first serve). I just don't see marauders on sep events because the high chance of them just walking ahead of the MI and killing every single sep within seconds like three of them did yesterday forcing us to just rocket them and blow a limb off to slow them down. The only trouble I see with seps would be an enemy marauder that could be solved with two ways, blow the fucker up OR call for a marauder but only if the need arises, even then three marauders isn't needed at all.

 

Bug events work a lot differently given the high chance of swarms and royal/tanker classes that can just fuck the MI up without blinking this is really the only spot I see marauders being effective and giving the MI a chance to be in the lead. Marauders can take the main force and the MI handle what they miss, and everybody still gets a fair share of shooting. Unlike sep missions though, the marauders could easily storm ahead and murder everybody while the MI kill two people making it just boring for the MI. 

 

Another thing I see that is common is shitty attitudes towards anybody and everybody from a few marauders. Sure people have free will, but this is an elite faction of the best of the best and most if not all have been an "NCO" in their characters past. This means they had to work with people, they have the experience and probably wouldn't of had that attitude during any of their marauder training or even BCT. So the shitty attitude doesn't help the marauders look like the elitists they should be but just another shit division that people laugh at. If you want to be a respected and needed faction ic and ooc marauders need to be respectable characters in the first place. Limiting the marauders or even changing scripts wont change shit other than the fact they are just not respected by anybody because of how they act. If they gain the respect, are trained properly to work WITH the MI and not on their own as I know they shouldn't then circumstances would be different.

To say that people dont respect/are memey/Edge lords or whatever yall are shouting in here as the marauders as a whole is both dumb, untrue and unproductive as well as off topic but here it goes.

 

None of these points are valid in the slightest, You or worthy dont play your marauder's period the fact that you suddenly know that nobody respects the marauders is strange due to the fact you both are rarely on. and untrue in my own opinion anyway.

 

 90% percent of the time there are roughly 1-2 marauders on doing passive and its usually with each other or a select few outside of my own character being Redbrick, Either way nobody in the marauders act's elitist at all toward the MI and if it does its far and few between and a response to some random guy calling us a tin can or "You're a marauder so your shit at everything." something dumb like that which would indeed get that response which just so happen to come from edgy admin char's, The mission where three marauders decimated your event only happened because we were ordered to CLEAR THE COMPOUND and the MI Mop up behind us three so they wouldn't get smacked on by the thousand people wall to wall in there along with drone emplacements out the ass... Honestly if i were to describe the compound the best thing i could say is that compound was literally made to make a no win scenario for the MI and just to force out injuries or outright PK's that you seemed to be focused on throughout the event itself, Let me just say right now during that specific even after we would clear a room killing the NPC or admin you all respawned yourselves repeatedly in the room after being gooked, Only just to randomly kill a few of the MI with basically one shotting weapons a few times... These MI that were just arriving literally only because we said the said floor/Room was clear or a specific level of the building even, was clear.Then we would immediately be order'd to come back  to smack on you again.

 

And we did just that sticking together and moving from room to room over and over again pausing in between giving time for both the MI to catch up along with the event runners to throw out some /event for us just incase we even got yelled at because we were stopping several times, All this just to make sure we weren't rushing the event we were having a fun time with along with everyone else. The fact you -HAD- to use rockets at the end to "Slow us down" is dumb there are a 100 different ways to do this which could have been used at any given time for all three of us, one of them being for example "Redbricks left leg locks up due to a 9mm round hitting her joint jamming it in place." <- It's not rocket science.

 

The only reason i can see that you are saying its "boring for the MI." is because you and the other two event runner's alone found it boring that nobody is getting hurt or PK'd because the marauders are making sure it doesn't happen if anything that would go to say we are doing great? Maybe, Just maybe you should ask the players themselves if its boring because it seems to me that there are only a select few staff that agree with you in the slightest meanwhile everyone else thinks its awesome.

 

(On a side note This happened repeatedly during the mission, I alone saw it happen at least three times causing people to get pissed off in the /Looc near me when one of the admins was on a rooftop sniping with one other admin before we switched to marauders we watched you die and then 5 minutes later spawn there again like nothing happened even when a whole squad cleared the roof and then this squad shouting in the radio that it was cleared... Suddenly they missed 12 separatists that now have respawned there along with an admin who can take a whole clip of belcher's and grenades surviving it all just so he can one shot you and everyone else spamming ooc for "If you died then /report it" which some of us did and were subsequently ignored or simply weren't paid attention too which in turn caused most people to just die repeatedly get respawned/teleported and then killed again in the same area the exact same way.)

 

Anyway, After clearing the rooms and making it to the top level we were at the last door wrenching it open, (On orders from dimov and young to clear the rest of the compound.) It became very apparent that you and the other two admins were targeting out of anger spamming rocket after rocket down a hallway at us which we waited for a moment to see if a /event would come through, When it didn't after about 2 mins we reacted by targeting all three of you individually utterly annihilating you on the orders of Medic's Young character as well as Dimov.. Not to mention subsequently after we killed all of you, 10mins later the /event shows up saying that Derpytoasts char had her arm blown off and then randomly tried to alter the injury onto myself as Redbrick even though i did not open the door nor get hit by your magical rocket spam collection causing me and derpytoast to immediately yell at you (Or whoever it was trying to alter the injury on somebody else for no reason.) and take it upon ourselves to force the original /event to injure kittel which was the correct way this ended up with a response of "Fine, Have it your way." like seriously? and then not to mention low and behold the dropship comes and leaves us down there with Medic's young character and an injured armless marauder which was stated in the radio before hand 5-10 min's after it was radioed several times by myself Medic's young char, Cipher's marauder char.

 

Again, truthfully you and worthy dont play on your marauder's if at all to contribute to how they are "Viewed" much less on the server itself as a whole to make a comment like this and be able to back it up with true facts, You and the other two admins running the event are literally just mad because we did what we were told correctly and you weren't prepared enough to do the event properly in response period and just wanted to shit on everyone with injuries and or PK's like its candy what was the premise of the event ? MI goes to kill a gang and destroy gang stuff but our lead decided to stab a cop causing us to fight an entire police station on a hearts and minds mission. Logic.

 

I forgot this too. If your going to bring up that event that you had plenty of time to prepare for the arrival of marauders? Well, If you didn't want marauder's on the event then you would have said in the debrief like many have done before hand for their event's "No suits marauders" or barred them outright but instead yall waited until we were out of the dropship for sometime to say "Get off your marauder, M.I. Characters only. " Through pm's causing a complete interruption of the RP and then we got called down anyway roughly 45 minutes later, this is dumb and i'm so tired of hearing all kinds of stupid things over this one specific event.

 

 

[Xalphox]

On 02/11/2017 at 11:37 AM, Xalphox said:

Came to conclusions with the XAs last night about this - a lot of this is being informed by them, but some of these are conclusions I have decided to draw and impose myself.

 

Right now we're going to CONSIDER revising the health of the marauders upwards somewhere between where it is or should be currently (300 - 1:3) up to a maximum of 1000 (1:10). This is not going to be a swift process - it is going to be a slow, careful, delicate and test-driven process, and it may even end up with them remaining at 300hp. The ultimate goal is to find a balance where the marauders in their current numbers do not risk tipping the scale too far in the favour of the MI or worse still risk leaving the MI feeling in any way redundant. If it remains the case that Marauders must be nerfed or even removed outright to maintain that balance then this is what we will do - the MI always takes precedence. Those that suggest giving marauders infinite HP isn't an issue are either too new or have too selective a memory to remember that this is exactly how they started - with 10,000 HP per marauder.

 

Considering the Marauders as an elite force is in my mind simply not on the table right now - not just because of the technical issues, but put bluntly their present perception as the most unserious, ERP-focused and memey of the three MI divisions. If we place the Marauders on a pedestal above others, they will not only become role models to the rest of the MI, but they will be looked to as a yard stick for the quality of roleplay on SSTRP in general. If they want me to reconsider this then they should restructure themselves into a division worthy of elevation rather than making vague hand-wavey promises that they will become elite if they're made elite.